Colonizing Europe
Sep. 24th, 2011 11:58 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
jhameiaThis conversation stems from a review here of Alastair Bonnet's Idea Of The West. (I was directed to his work by a prof, and he works on whiteness, anti-racism and psychogeography.) So I present to you an excellent conversation with jaded16 of Oi With the Poodles Already.
Jaymee: now i'm not sure if the review just hasn't really talked about it
but by claiming that the non-west invented the west
it sort of takes away the impact European colonialism has had on third world countries today that have their own ideas of what the West is like
Jaded: Uh okay that is one weirdarse text
Jaymee: yeah
i mean, i can kind of see his point
that historically, those of us in "the East"
(fuck this non-West nonsense)
have had our own discourses about the West
that resembles the West's discourses about the East
but
i'm not sure that the discourse from the East impacted the West in the same way
Jaded: exactly
Jaymee: mostly because there isn't very much in the West to colonize anyway
Jaded: and they started first, so our view of the "west" is coloured by what they say of us
Jaymee: yeah
Jaymee: and it continues too
so to say "the idea of the West was invented by the non-West" is kind of disingenuous
because, of course we invented the idea of the West first
we were aware of the West before they even founded their own civilizations
Jaded: YES
but the way we went about doing things with that knowledge was very different than what they did
Jaymee: yes
exactly!
except for Genghis Khan
we largely left them the fuck alone
Jaded: Yes, but he didn't form empires
he wanted to
but couldn't
what it comes down to, who had the structural power to claim racial superiority
Jaymee: and the West just so happened to be in the right place at the right time with the right structures to impose themselves on the rest of the world
Jaded: yes, exactly
to deny that and say we did the exact amount of damage as much as they did to us
is ridiculous
Jaymee: i dont think that's his argument
but it's easy to construe his argument that way
Jaded: I skimmed it, can't say I liked what I saw
Jaymee: neither do i
but then the review comes from a swarthy dude who prolly has his own biases =)
Jaded: Ha yes, I was just going to say that
braintwin moment
Jaymee: am trying to think if Asian empires would have tried to conquer Europe if we had the infrastructure for it
Jaded: maybe?
Jaymee: i mean, even China didnt bother, they just demanded tribute
and seeded local communities
Jaded: don't doubt our potential to colonise
not one bit
just that we didn't have enough resources
Jaymee: potential is one thing, but thereès not a a hell lot in Europe to colonize, is there?
when we have each other to fight already
Jaded: there could be
HA yes
Jaymee: i mean, we are awesome
we got so much
of course we're gonna fight over each others' toys
Jaded: and tv time
Jaymee: yeah
what's the little corner of North West Asia got to offer us that we'd fight over it?
Jaded: snow?
Jaymee: China got snow
Japan got snow
nobody gives a shit about Hokkaido except to say HEY WE GOT IT
Jaded: True
Okay, so what does Europe have besides snow?
JHA THIS IS BUMMING ME OUT
I CAN'T THINK OF A THING
Jaymee: they have coal?
maybe iron?
Jaded: we have that
and bauxite also
Jaymee: ....
yeah i'm stumped too
Jaded: huh.
Jaymee: i mean if we really wanted those things from Europe
i guess we could colonize them economically
make them dependent on our trade
Jaded: Huh.
Jaymee: ike today's neocolonism
Jaded: But what would they have to offer to us
Jaymee: well china liked to demand silver
Jaded: you see Jha, why they needed to colonise us. THEY KNEW THEY HAD NOTHING MUCH EXCEPT SNOW
Jaymee: which the british had to buy from the rest of europe
pretty much
England especially
rainy island with an inferiority complex
Jaded: yes, I know
and an ugly as fuck monarch
with hairline issues
Jaymee: MANY ugly monarches
the only pretty ones were women
Jaded: yes
Jaymee: except queen victoria
after ALfred died she was a cow
Jaded: I KNOW
UGH
a pug actually
Jaymee: yes pugs are more british
Jaded: there's a reason why they are
Jaymee: ok British bulldogs
WHY
Jaded: they resembled their queen
Jaymee: bwaha
she wasn't THAT wrinkly
Jaded: Eh. Give or take a few years.
Jaymee: also
completely different from what we were just talking about
i apparently have no idea how bananas work
this banana is like green at the tips
andi dunno if it's ripe or not
Jaded: ugh why
Jaymee: i mean it ought to be
Jaded: I don't know either!
Jaymee: fucking bananas
why am i supposed to each you just to poop once a day
*eat
at least ya'll were cheap
Jaded: escapes me too
Jaymee: and it's not sweet
SEE
NOTHING TO COLONIZE IN THE WEST
THEY EVEN GET OUR FRUITS WRONG
Jaded: I KNOW
JUST SNOW AND BULLDOGS
Jaymee: TERRIERS ARE CUTE BUT NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaded: OOH BUT WHAT ABOUT POLAR BEARS?
Jaymee: NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaded: (wait that's not the West)
Jaymee: we'd just hunt the shit out of them
Jaded: Or make them sing the Ramayan
and make them Vegetarians
NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaymee: vegetarian polar bears singing the Ramayan would be cool but DEFINITELY NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
we already got our own tap dancing cows mooing the Geeta
Jaded: exactly
too much ramayan bores the brain
NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaymee: exactly
Jaded: Maybe our brown/yellow brains are too biased
want to ask people out there?
Jaymee: we should ask white people what's there in their countries to colonize
Jaded: YES
Thus this post.
jaded16 of Oi With the Poodles Already.Jaymee: now i'm not sure if the review just hasn't really talked about it
but by claiming that the non-west invented the west
it sort of takes away the impact European colonialism has had on third world countries today that have their own ideas of what the West is like
Jaded: Uh okay that is one weirdarse text
Jaymee: yeah
i mean, i can kind of see his point
that historically, those of us in "the East"
(fuck this non-West nonsense)
have had our own discourses about the West
that resembles the West's discourses about the East
but
i'm not sure that the discourse from the East impacted the West in the same way
Jaded: exactly
Jaymee: mostly because there isn't very much in the West to colonize anyway
Jaded: and they started first, so our view of the "west" is coloured by what they say of us
Jaymee: yeah
Jaymee: and it continues too
so to say "the idea of the West was invented by the non-West" is kind of disingenuous
because, of course we invented the idea of the West first
we were aware of the West before they even founded their own civilizations
Jaded: YES
but the way we went about doing things with that knowledge was very different than what they did
Jaymee: yes
exactly!
except for Genghis Khan
we largely left them the fuck alone
Jaded: Yes, but he didn't form empires
he wanted to
but couldn't
what it comes down to, who had the structural power to claim racial superiority
Jaymee: and the West just so happened to be in the right place at the right time with the right structures to impose themselves on the rest of the world
Jaded: yes, exactly
to deny that and say we did the exact amount of damage as much as they did to us
is ridiculous
Jaymee: i dont think that's his argument
but it's easy to construe his argument that way
Jaded: I skimmed it, can't say I liked what I saw
Jaymee: neither do i
but then the review comes from a swarthy dude who prolly has his own biases =)
Jaded: Ha yes, I was just going to say that
braintwin moment
Jaymee: am trying to think if Asian empires would have tried to conquer Europe if we had the infrastructure for it
Jaded: maybe?
Jaymee: i mean, even China didnt bother, they just demanded tribute
and seeded local communities
Jaded: don't doubt our potential to colonise
not one bit
just that we didn't have enough resources
Jaymee: potential is one thing, but thereès not a a hell lot in Europe to colonize, is there?
when we have each other to fight already
Jaded: there could be
HA yes
Jaymee: i mean, we are awesome
we got so much
of course we're gonna fight over each others' toys
Jaded: and tv time
Jaymee: yeah
what's the little corner of North West Asia got to offer us that we'd fight over it?
Jaded: snow?
Jaymee: China got snow
Japan got snow
nobody gives a shit about Hokkaido except to say HEY WE GOT IT
Jaded: True
Okay, so what does Europe have besides snow?
JHA THIS IS BUMMING ME OUT
I CAN'T THINK OF A THING
Jaymee: they have coal?
maybe iron?
Jaded: we have that
and bauxite also
Jaymee: ....
yeah i'm stumped too
Jaded: huh.
Jaymee: i mean if we really wanted those things from Europe
i guess we could colonize them economically
make them dependent on our trade
Jaded: Huh.
Jaymee: ike today's neocolonism
Jaded: But what would they have to offer to us
Jaymee: well china liked to demand silver
Jaded: you see Jha, why they needed to colonise us. THEY KNEW THEY HAD NOTHING MUCH EXCEPT SNOW
Jaymee: which the british had to buy from the rest of europe
pretty much
England especially
rainy island with an inferiority complex
Jaded: yes, I know
and an ugly as fuck monarch
with hairline issues
Jaymee: MANY ugly monarches
the only pretty ones were women
Jaded: yes
Jaymee: except queen victoria
after ALfred died she was a cow
Jaded: I KNOW
UGH
a pug actually
Jaymee: yes pugs are more british
Jaded: there's a reason why they are
Jaymee: ok British bulldogs
WHY
Jaded: they resembled their queen
Jaymee: bwaha
she wasn't THAT wrinkly
Jaded: Eh. Give or take a few years.
Jaymee: also
completely different from what we were just talking about
i apparently have no idea how bananas work
this banana is like green at the tips
andi dunno if it's ripe or not
Jaded: ugh why
Jaymee: i mean it ought to be
Jaded: I don't know either!
Jaymee: fucking bananas
why am i supposed to each you just to poop once a day
*eat
at least ya'll were cheap
Jaded: escapes me too
Jaymee: and it's not sweet
SEE
NOTHING TO COLONIZE IN THE WEST
THEY EVEN GET OUR FRUITS WRONG
Jaded: I KNOW
JUST SNOW AND BULLDOGS
Jaymee: TERRIERS ARE CUTE BUT NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaded: OOH BUT WHAT ABOUT POLAR BEARS?
Jaymee: NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaded: (wait that's not the West)
Jaymee: we'd just hunt the shit out of them
Jaded: Or make them sing the Ramayan
and make them Vegetarians
NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaymee: vegetarian polar bears singing the Ramayan would be cool but DEFINITELY NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
we already got our own tap dancing cows mooing the Geeta
Jaded: exactly
too much ramayan bores the brain
NOT ENOUGH TO GO TO WAR OVER
Jaymee: exactly
Jaded: Maybe our brown/yellow brains are too biased
want to ask people out there?
Jaymee: we should ask white people what's there in their countries to colonize
Jaded: YES
Thus this post.